stronger Kex

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stronger Kex

mlrx
Hello,

I have two servers for testing purpose :
- debian 6, apache 2.2,   openssl 1.0.1t      (mutu)
- centos 7, apache 2.4.6, openssl 1.0.1e-fips (dedicated)

Now, these 2 serveurs offers only those ciphers :
TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (0xc030)
TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384 (0xc028)
TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA (0xc014)

I have two goals. First, I would like to use at least secp384r1
and second (no problem), use an ECC certificate.

Is it possible to do it with CHACHA20-POLY1305 ?
Is it possible to use this cipher on those servers ?

openssl ciphers -V CHACHA20 return an error on each server.
I understand it's because there is no chacha20 cipher (?).

Why can I connect a server by SSH with [hidden email]
and not using it with Apache ?

All advices are welcome :-).

Best regards,
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Re: stronger Kex

mlrx
Le 21/12/2016 à 16:07, mlrx a écrit :

> Hello,
>
> I have two servers for testing purpose :
> - debian 6, apache 2.2,   openssl 1.0.1t      (mutu)
> - centos 7, apache 2.4.6, openssl 1.0.1e-fips (dedicated)
>
> Now, these 2 serveurs offers only those ciphers :
> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (0xc030)
> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384 (0xc028)
> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA (0xc014)
>
> I have two goals. First, I would like to use at least secp384r1
> and second (no problem), use an ECC certificate.
>
> Is it possible to do it with CHACHA20-POLY1305 ?
> Is it possible to use this cipher on those servers ?
>
> openssl ciphers -V CHACHA20 return an error on each server.
> I understand it's because there is no chacha20 cipher (?).
>
> Why can I connect a server by SSH with [hidden email]
> and not using it with Apache ?
>
> All advices are welcome :-).
>
> Best regards,

Hello,
Is somebody could explain me the difference between a message who
received an answer and this one ?
What's wrong ? RTFM ?

Best regards,
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Re: stronger Kex

Jakob Bohm-7
On 27/12/2016 09:15, mlrx wrote:

> Le 21/12/2016 à 16:07, mlrx a écrit :
>> Hello,
>>
>> I have two servers for testing purpose :
>> - debian 6, apache 2.2,   openssl 1.0.1t      (mutu)
>> - centos 7, apache 2.4.6, openssl 1.0.1e-fips (dedicated)
>>
>> Now, these 2 serveurs offers only those ciphers :
>> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (0xc030)
>> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384 (0xc028)
>> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA (0xc014)
>>
>> I have two goals. First, I would like to use at least secp384r1
>> and second (no problem), use an ECC certificate.
>>
>> Is it possible to do it with CHACHA20-POLY1305 ?
>> Is it possible to use this cipher on those servers ?
>>
>> openssl ciphers -V CHACHA20 return an error on each server.
>> I understand it's because there is no chacha20 cipher (?).
>>
>> Why can I connect a server by SSH with [hidden email]
>> and not using it with Apache ?
>>
>> All advices are welcome :-).
>>
>> Best regards,
> Hello,
> Is somebody could explain me the difference between a message who
> received an answer and this one ?
> What's wrong ? RTFM ?
Even though at least one SSH program (OpenSSH) uses the crypto functions
from the OpenSSL libcrypto, the SSH protocol is completely unrealted to
the SSL/TLS security protocol.

So the ability to use specific settings with SSH is almost completely
unrelated to the ability to use similarly named settings for SSL.

One major difference is that SSH identifies cryptographic suites by
strings that can easily be extended by organizations such as openssh.com.

In contrast, SSL/TLS identifies cryptographic suites by 16 bit numbers
specified in RFCs and listed in a table published by IANA/ICANN. Thus
for SSL/TLS libraries such as OpenSSL can really only provide choices
that were given an official number in an RFC and added to that table
as part of the RFC publishing process.

On top of that, the OpenSSL team has a policy of only implementing new
SSL/TLS cryptographic suites when the number part of the OpenSSL version
number changes.  Thus anything not included in the original OpenSSL
1.0.2 release will only be available in 1.1.0 or an even later release
(because they will not be making a 1.0.3 release).  Similarly anything
not in the original 1.1.0 release will only be in 1.2.0 or later
(assuming there is no 1.1.1 release).

Enjoy

Jakob
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Transformervej 29, 2860 Søborg, Denmark.  Direct +45 31 13 16 10
This public discussion message is non-binding and may contain errors.
WiseMo - Remote Service Management for PCs, Phones and Embedded

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Re: stronger Kex

Jeffrey Walton-3
In reply to this post by mlrx
> I have two servers for testing purpose :
> - debian 6, apache 2.2,   openssl 1.0.1t      (mutu)
> - centos 7, apache 2.4.6, openssl 1.0.1e-fips (dedicated)
>
> Now, these 2 serveurs offers only those ciphers :
> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (0xc030)
> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384 (0xc028)
> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA (0xc014)
>
> I have two goals. First, I would like to use at least secp384r1
> and second (no problem), use an ECC certificate.
>
> Is it possible to do it with CHACHA20-POLY1305 ?
> Is it possible to use this cipher on those servers ?

You need OpenSSL 1.1.0 or above for ChaCha20/Poly1305:

$ openssl version
OpenSSL 1.1.0b  26 Sep 2016

$ openssl ciphers | tr ':' '\n' | grep -i chacha
ECDHE-ECDSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305
ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305
DHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305
RSA-PSK-CHACHA20-POLY1305
DHE-PSK-CHACHA20-POLY1305
ECDHE-PSK-CHACHA20-POLY1305
PSK-CHACHA20-POLY1305

Jeff
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Re: stronger Kex

OpenSSL - User mailing list
In reply to this post by Jakob Bohm-7
Hello,
Thank you for this very useful explanation and your time.
I apologize for the delay in response.
Best regards,
benoist.

Le 27/12/2016 à 10:16, Jakob Bohm wrote :

> On 27/12/2016 09:15, mlrx wrote:
>> Le 21/12/2016 à 16:07, mlrx a écrit :
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> I have two servers for testing purpose :
>>> - debian 6, apache 2.2,   openssl 1.0.1t      (mutu)
>>> - centos 7, apache 2.4.6, openssl 1.0.1e-fips (dedicated)
>>>
>>> Now, these 2 serveurs offers only those ciphers :
>>> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (0xc030)
>>> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384 (0xc028)
>>> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA (0xc014)
>>>
>>> I have two goals. First, I would like to use at least secp384r1
>>> and second (no problem), use an ECC certificate.
>>>
>>> Is it possible to do it with CHACHA20-POLY1305 ?
>>> Is it possible to use this cipher on those servers ?
>>>
>>> openssl ciphers -V CHACHA20 return an error on each server.
>>> I understand it's because there is no chacha20 cipher (?).
>>>
>>> Why can I connect a server by SSH with [hidden email]
>>> and not using it with Apache ?
>>>
>>> All advices are welcome :-).
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>> Hello,
>> Is somebody could explain me the difference between a message who
>> received an answer and this one ?
>> What's wrong ? RTFM ?
> Even though at least one SSH program (OpenSSH) uses the crypto functions
> from the OpenSSL libcrypto, the SSH protocol is completely unrealted to
> the SSL/TLS security protocol.
>
> So the ability to use specific settings with SSH is almost completely
> unrelated to the ability to use similarly named settings for SSL.
>
> One major difference is that SSH identifies cryptographic suites by
> strings that can easily be extended by organizations such as openssh.com.
>
> In contrast, SSL/TLS identifies cryptographic suites by 16 bit numbers
> specified in RFCs and listed in a table published by IANA/ICANN. Thus
> for SSL/TLS libraries such as OpenSSL can really only provide choices
> that were given an official number in an RFC and added to that table
> as part of the RFC publishing process.
>
> On top of that, the OpenSSL team has a policy of only implementing new
> SSL/TLS cryptographic suites when the number part of the OpenSSL version
> number changes.  Thus anything not included in the original OpenSSL
> 1.0.2 release will only be available in 1.1.0 or an even later release
> (because they will not be making a 1.0.3 release).  Similarly anything
> not in the original 1.1.0 release will only be in 1.2.0 or later
> (assuming there is no 1.1.1 release).
>
> Enjoy
>
> Jakob


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Re: stronger Kex

OpenSSL - User mailing list
In reply to this post by Jeffrey Walton-3
Hello,
I also thank you. It was useful to.
Best regards.
benoist

Le 27/12/2016 à 17:38, Jeffrey Walton wrote :

>> I have two servers for testing purpose :
>> - debian 6, apache 2.2,   openssl 1.0.1t      (mutu)
>> - centos 7, apache 2.4.6, openssl 1.0.1e-fips (dedicated)
>>
>> Now, these 2 serveurs offers only those ciphers :
>> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (0xc030)
>> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384 (0xc028)
>> TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA (0xc014)
>>
>> I have two goals. First, I would like to use at least secp384r1
>> and second (no problem), use an ECC certificate.
>>
>> Is it possible to do it with CHACHA20-POLY1305 ?
>> Is it possible to use this cipher on those servers ?
>
> You need OpenSSL 1.1.0 or above for ChaCha20/Poly1305:
>
> $ openssl version
> OpenSSL 1.1.0b  26 Sep 2016
>
> $ openssl ciphers | tr ':' '\n' | grep -i chacha
> ECDHE-ECDSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305
> ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305
> DHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305
> RSA-PSK-CHACHA20-POLY1305
> DHE-PSK-CHACHA20-POLY1305
> ECDHE-PSK-CHACHA20-POLY1305
> PSK-CHACHA20-POLY1305
>
> Jeff
>


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